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RELEASED TO DIE EPISODE 1

RING

JULIETA:  HELLO? SUAVE?

SUAVE: YES.

JULIETA: I WAS IN A MEETING. I JUST READ YOUR TEXT.

MARIA: IT’S JANUARY 9, 2026 AND PRODUCER JULIETA MARTINELLI STEPS OUT OF A MEETING TO ANSWER A CALL.

JULIETA: HE IS GETTING OUT TODAY?

SUAVE: YEAH. I’M, I’M HEADING RIGHT THERE TO THE NURSING HOME RIGHT NOW.

MARIA: IT’S A CALL WE’VE BEEN WAITING FOR FOR A LONG TIME.

SUAVE: THEY… AS WE SPEAK, THEY’RE TRANSFERRING HIM OUT NOW. THE REASON THEY-

JULIETA: OH MY GOD.

SUAVE: THE REASON THEY DIDN’T TELL US YESTERDAY, BECAUSE THE POLICIES. THEY CAN’T TELL YOU WHEN THEY COMING OUT.

MARIA: JULIETA’S ON THE PHONE WITH SUAVE – FORMER JUVENILE LIFER AND THE SUBJECT OF OUR PULITZER PRIZE WINNING PODCAST ABOUT LIFE AFTER INCARCERATION.  I MET SUAVE OVER 30 YEARS AGO AND STAYED IN TOUCH WITH HIM FOR DECADES WHILE HE WAS IN PRISON THEN IN OUR PODCAST “SUAVE”, WE DOCUMENTED HIS RELEASE IN 2017 AND HIS RE-ENTRY. JULIETA WAS A PRODUCER AND HOST OF THE SECOND SEASON OF THE PODCAST.

JULIETA: IN OUR SECOND SEASON, WE MET SUAVE’S MENTOR AND FATHER FIGURE IN PRISON – A MAN IN HIS 90’S NAMED FRANK ROSS. FRANK WAS AWAITING A DECISION THAT COULD GRANT HIM HIS RELEASE FROM PRISON. AND TODAY – THERE WAS FINALLY NEWS.

JULIETA: OH, SHIT.

SUAVE: BUT HE, HE IS BEING TRANSFERRED AS WE SPEAK

JULIETA: OKAY. I’M GONNA… I’M TRYING TO FIND A FLIGHT, TONIGHT, AS SOON AS POSSIBLE. HOW DO YOU FEEL?

FRANK: OH, MAN, EMOTIONAL. I MEAN- YEAH … IT’S BEEN YEARS THAT MAN BEEN IN PRISON. YEAH.

MARIA: AFTER NEARLY FIFTY YEARS BEHIND BARS, FRANK ROSS WAS FREE.

[BEAT]

MARIA: THERE WERE NO FRIENDS OR FAMILY WAITING OUTSIDE THE PRISON GATES. FRANK WAS TRANSFERRED ALONE IN A GURNEY.

[MUSIC]

JULIETA: THAT’S BECAUSE FRANK IS BEING RELEASED UNDER PENNSYLVANIA’S COMPASSIONATE RELEASE STATUTE – ALSO KNOWN AS A MEDICAL TRANSFER. THAT’S A LAW THAT CREATES A PATHWAY FOR SERIOUSLY ILL PEOPLE TO BE RELEASED TO SEEK OUT BETTER CARE ON THE OUTSIDE.  FRANK HAS BEEN BATTLING CANCER FOR YEARS – HE’S NOW TERMINAL.

JULIETA: DO YOU REMEMBER WHEN THE ONLY SORT OF, LIKE, BIG WEIGHT, YOU FELT ON YOUR BACK WAS THAT YOU COULDN’T DO ANYTHING FOR HIM?

SUAVE: YEAH, I REMEMBER THAT…YEAH.

MARIA: FOR YEARS SUAVE TOLD ME OF THE GUILT AND REGRET HE FELT AT LEAVING FRANK ALONE INSIDE AFTER HE WAS RELEASED FROM PRISON. FRANK TAUGHT SUAVE HOW TO READ AND WRITE, HE MENTORED AND FATHERED HIM – ALONG WITH HUNDREDS OF OTHER YOUNG MEN IN PRISON. IN EXCHANGE, SUAVE ALWAYS THOUGHT HE’D HELP CARE FOR FRANK IN HIS FINAL DAYS WHEN THEY WERE BOTH IN PRISON.

SUAVE: YOU KNOW, YOU’RE NOT-

JULIETA: AND LOOK WHAT’S HAPPENING … OH, I CAN’T BELIEVE IT. OKAY. WELL, THIS TOOK ME TOTALLY BY SURPRISE, BUT I’M HAPPY. I’M HAPPY FOR YOU

MARIA: NOW, SUAVE COULD REPAY THE MAN WHO HAD GIVEN HIM SO MUCH. AND FRANK ROSS WOULD JUST MAYBE HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY FOR A DIGNIFIED DEATH, ON THE OUTSIDE.

MAYBE — BECAUSE NOTHING IN THE PRISON SYSTEM IS EVER SIMPLE.

[LUSA THEME]

MARIA: FROM FUTURO MEDIA, IT’S LATINO USA. I’M MARIA HINOJOSA. TODAY… RELEASED TO DIE, PART ONE. IN THIS THREE EPISODE MINI SERIES WE ARE GOING TO FOLLOW THE STORY OF FRANK ROSS, HE IS A 93-YEAR-OLD MAN SENTENCED TO DIE IN PRISON AND WE ARE GOING TO FOLLOW HIS JOURNEY TO THE OUTSIDE THROUGH SOMETHING KNOWN AS COMPASSIONATE RELEASE.

FRANK’S CASE HIGHLIGHTS ONE OF THE FASTEST GROWING TRENDS IN INCARCERATION IN THE UNITED STATES. IT’S SOMETHING EXPERTS CALL THE GRAYING OF AMERICAN PRISONS. WE ALSO TAKE A DEEP DIVE INTO PENNSYLVANIA’S COMPASSIONATE RELEASE PROGRAM, HOW HEALTHCARE INSIDE PRISONS IS FAILING OLDER PEOPLE AND WHAT IT MEANS TO HAVE A CHANCE TO DIE FREE.

[THEME MUSIC END]

MARIA: BETWEEN 2001 AND 2018, MORE THAN 30,000 PEOPLE AGED 55 OR OLDER DIED IN PRISON. EXPERTS SAY  THOSE NUMBERS ARE ON THE RISE.

MUSIC

MARIA: NEVER HAVE THERE BEEN SO MANY OLDER PEOPLE BEHIND BARS – AND THE NUMBER IS STEADILY RISING. BY 2030, THEY WILL BE ONE THIRD OF THE PRISON POPULATION

JULIETA: THE REASON? HARSH SENTENCING PRACTICES THAT STARTED IN THE 70S – AND PEAKED THROUGH THE 80S AND 90S TO TODAY. DATA SHOWS THAT THIS LED TO MORE PEOPLE THAN EVER SERVING LONG SENTENCES, INCLUDING LIFE WITHOUT PAROLE. AND YOU’VE PROBABLY HEARD THE TERM MANDATORY MINIMUMS.

MARIA: COUPLED WITH THREE STRIKE LAWS AND OTHER TOUGH ON CRIME POLICIES, THAT MEANT MORE PEOPLE GOING TO PRISON – AND FOR LONGER PERIODS OF TIME. PRISON POPULATIONS EXPLODED, WITH VAST RACIAL DISCREPANCIES IN SENTENCING. AND WITH SO MANY LIFE SENTENCES OR DECADES-LONG SENTENCES …IT WAS ONLY A MATTER OF TIME UNTIL THOSE PEOPLE BECAME OLDER AND SICKER, WITH PRISONS UNABLE TO MEET THEIR HEALTHCARE NEEDS.

JULIETA: THAT’S PART OF THE REASON WHY ALMOST EVERY STATE – AND THE FEDERAL PRISON SYSTEM – HAS SOME TYPE OF COMPASSIONATE RELEASE POLICY. IT’S A WAY TO GRANT EARLY RELEASE FROM PRISON TO SICK OR ELDERLY INCARCERATED INDIVIDUALS WHO HAVE NO OTHER REAL AVENUE WITHIN THE COURT SYSTEM.

IN PENNSYLVANIA PRISONS, WHERE FRANK ROSS IS, AN INCARCERATED PERSON MAY PETITION THE COURT FOR A TEMPORARY TRANSFER TO EITHER A HOSPITAL, LONG-TERM FACILITY OR HOSPICE. IN ORDER TO BE CONSIDERED, SOMEONE LIKE FRANK MUST MEET SEVEN DIFFERENT PARAMETERS. MOST IMPORTANTLY, THEY MUST BE SERIOUSLY ILL, EXPECTED TO HAVE LESS THAN A YEAR TO LIVE, AND BE ABLE TO PROVE THEIR HEALTHCARE NEEDS ARE BETTER MET ON THE OUTSIDE. IF THEY WERE TO BE CURED OF THEIR TERMINAL ILLNESS ON THE OUTSIDE, THEY COULD BE RETURNED TO PRISON.

MARIA: COMPASSIONATE RELEASE IS FOR PEOPLE THAT KNOW THEY’RE GOING TO DIE — THE QUESTION IS, WILL THEY GET TO DIE ON THE OUTSIDE? AND THAT’S ALL THAT FRANK ROSS HOPES FOR. JULIETA IS GOING TO PICK UP THE STORY FROM HERE.

JULIETA: THE DAY OF FRANK’S RELEASE, SUAVE RUSHES TO THE HEALTHCARE FACILITY FOR SENIORS WHERE HE’S BEEN TRANSFERRED. FRANK IS ALREADY THERE. IN A SHARED ROOM SEPARATED BY A FLIMSY CURTAIN, SURROUNDED BY BARE WHITE WALLS. HE TEXTS ME TO FACETIME HIM.

SUAVE:  YOU WANNA TALK TO HIM?

JULIETA: YES. MR. ROSS. CONGRATULATIONS!

SUAVE: [OFF MIC] YOU DON’T HAVE TO DO THAT. JUST TALK TO THE PHONE.  [ON PHONE] THE FIRST TIME HE HELD A CELL PHONE. YEAH.

JULIETA: OH, WOW. YEAH. WOW. TECHNOLOGY’S REALLY CHANGED..

JULIETA: FRANK TRIES TO PUT THE VIDEO CALL TO HIS EAR. HE’S NEVER HELD A CELL PHONE — HE WAS CONVICTED IN 1980  AND WAS ALWAYS KIND OF AN OLD SCHOOL GUY IN PRISON. HE NEVER EVEN GOT A TABLET.

JULIETA: HI, MR. ROSS. HOW ARE YOU? CONGRATULATIONS!

FRANK: THIS GUY HAS GOT A GOOD LOOK RIGHT NOW. TELL HIM THAT.

JULIETA: REALLY?

FRANK: HE DONE LOST SOME WEIGHT. HE LOOK GOOD.

JULIETA: ON HIS FIRST DAY OUT OF PRISON, FRANK SEEMS PRIMARILY OCCUPIED WITH SUAVE’S WEIGHT. HE CALLS SUAVE HIS SON AFTER ALL.

JULIETA:  HE LOOKS GOOD, RIGHT? HOW DO YOU FEEL?

FRANK: UH, BELIEVE ME, BUT, UH, I’M TALKING ABOUT HIM RIGHT NOW.

JULIETA: NOW, FRANK IS HARD TO UNDERSTAND. HE’S 93, HE’S LOST HIS TEETH AND HE DOESN’T HAVE DENTURES. BESIDES THE RAVAGES OF CANCER, HE IS ALSO STRUGGLING WITH COGNITIVE DECLINE, DUE TO DEMENTIA. OVER THE LAST FEW YEARS IN PRISON, HE WAS MOSTLY BEDRIDDEN, SOMETIMES IN A WHEELCHAIR, AND FULLY DEPENDENT ON OTHER INCARCERATED MEN TO CARE FOR HIM.

FRANK: YEAH. BUT HOW ARE YOU TODAY?

JULIETA: I’M VERY HAPPY BECAUSE OF YOUR NEWS.

FRANK: ARE YOU GONNA COME TO VISIT ME TOMORROW?

JULIETA:  I AM, YES. I, I’M, UM, I’M GETTING ON A PLANE TONIGHT SO I CAN SEE YOU TOMORROW MORNING.

FRANK: OH, WHENEVER. I’LL BE HERE.

JULIETA: BEFORE WE HANG UP THE PHONE, FRANK LAYS DOWN HIS CHIEF INTEREST IN LETTING US IN TO MAKE THIS SERIES. HE’S HOPING IT WILL HELP HIM BRING SOME ATTENTION TO HIS WRITING.

SUAVE: GOTTA GET HIM AN AGENT BECAUSE HE’S TRYING TO GET SOME OF HIS WORK OUT.

YOU HAVE YOUR BOXES AND STUFF WITH YOU? YES.

SUAVE: OF COURSE, WE GONNA TRY TO GET YOU AN AGENT.

[MUSIC]

JULIETA: FRANK HOPES TO GET MORE OF HIS WRITING PUBLISHED BEFORE HE DIES. THE ONLY ITEM FRANK INSISTED ON BRINGING WITH HIM FROM HIS PRISON CELL WAS A BOX FILLED WITH STORIES. NEARLY FIVE DECADES OF WRITING. TO UNDERSTAND WHO FRANK IS AS A PERSON, YOU HAVE TO UNDERSTAND THAT ABOVE ALL HE IS A WRITER. AND WRITERS DREAM OF SHARING THEIR LOVE OF WORDS.

[BEAT]

JULIETA: THAT’S HOW SUAVE AND FRANK CROSSED PATHS THREE DECADES AGO AT A MAXIMUM SECURITY PRISON IN PHILADELPHIA. SUAVE WAS IN HIS EARLY 20’S, AND FRANK WAS IN HIS LATE 50’S. WE ACTUALLY TOLD THIS STORY AT LENGTH IN AN EPISODE OF SUAVE SEASON 2, BUT I’LL GIVE YOU A SUMMARY –

SUAVE: HEY FRANK. WHAT’S GOING ON BUDDY?

JULIETA: THIS IS A PHONE CALL BETWEEN SUAVE AND FRANK FROM 2023, WHEN FRANK WAS STILL IN PRISON.

FRANK: NOT, NOT MUCH.

SUAVE: I’M OVER HERE, MAN. I’M OVER HERE TELLING THE, UH, MY PEOPLE HOW MUCH YOU SHOWED ME WHEN I WAS IN PRISON, RIGHT? WHAT DO YOU DO?

FRANK: I LEARNED HOW TO WRITE FICTION SINCE I’VE BEEN HERE

SUAVE: HOW MANY SCREENPLAYS HAVE YOU WRITTEN

FRANK: WELL, I GOT 45 NOW AND I GOT ABOUT 90 SHORT STORIES.

JULIETA: 45 SCREENPLAYS AND 90 SHORT STORIES. A PORTION OF IT WAS PUBLISHED. FRANK WAS PROFILED IN NEWSPAPERS DECADES AGO, SOME OF HIS BOOKS ARE STILL OUT THERE FOR PURCHASE. AND MORE THAN A WRITER – FRANK, WAS A TEACHER

SUAVE: THERE WAS HUNDREDS IF NOT THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE IN THE D. O. C. THAT HE SHOWED HOW TO READ AND WRITE, AND I WAS ONE OF THEM..

JULIETA: FRANK WAS AN OLD HEAD – AN OLD TIMER, AND SOMEONE WHO COMMANDED RESPECT. SUAVE SAYS FRANK DIDN’T GET INVOLVED IN PRISON POLITICS, HE NEVER GOT IN TROUBLE, AND HE MINDED HIS OWN BUSINESS. WHEN HE TOOK A LIKING TO SOMEONE THOUGH, HE APPROACHED THEM WITH A CURIOUS PROPOSITION —

SUAVE: HE WAS ONE OF THE DUDES THAT HE, UH, HAD ENOUGH HEART TO STEP TO ME, I GUESS. HE WAS LIKE, HEY, YOUNG BOY, LET ME TALK TO YOU. AND I USED TO TELL HIM, LOOK, MAN, WHAT CAN YOU GET FOR ME? AND HE SAID, I GOT SOME PEN AND PAPER FOR YOU

JULIETA: THAT’S HOW HE AND SUAVE BECAME CLOSE. SUAVE WAS ILLITERATE, BUT OVER TIME, AND UNDER A TEACHER LIKE FRANK, SUAVE LEARNED HOW TO READ AND WRITE. FRANK THEN ENCOURAGED HIM TO PURSUE AN EDUCATION, AND SUAVE EVENTUALLY GRADUATED WITH A BACHELOR’S WITHIN PRISON WALLS. FRANK DID THE SAME FOR COUNTLESS OTHERS.

OVER TIME, SUAVE LEARNED THAT FRANK HAD MADE A PROMISE. TO TRY AND ATONE FOR HIS MISTAKES AND TO HELP OTHERS. HERE’S ANOTHER OLD PHONE CALL WITH FRANK WHEN HE WAS IN PRISON –

FRANK: I’VE BEEN INCARCERATED FOR 43 YEARS FOR FIRST DEGREE MURDER.

JULIETA: IN HIS LATE 40S, FRANK WAS CONVICTED OF KILLING A MAN. UNTIL THEN, HE’D NEVER BEEN IN TROUBLE. HE WAS A WAR VETERAN. HE HAD A BUSINESS, A WIFE, AND KIDS.

SUAVE:  I USED TO CALL HIM THE LATE CRIMINAL , FAMILY MAN, GROWN KIDS, FIRST TIME EVER ARRESTED IN HIS LIFE.

JULIETA: FRANK DOESN’T CLAIM TO BE INNOCENT – HE ACCEPTED HIS LIFE SENTENCE AND IN PRISON PUT THE OLD VERSION OF HIMSELF AWAY. HE REFUSED VISITS, HE ASKED HIS FAMILY TO MOVE ON, AND SPENT NEARLY HIS ENTIRE TIME IN PRISON COMPLETELY ALONE. EXCEPT, FOR THE YOUNG MEN HE TOOK UNDER HIS WING. NOW, YEARS LATER, AS I PREPARE TO GO MEET HIM IN PERSON FOR THE FIRST TIME, I THINK ABOUT A CONVERSATION I HAD WITH FRANK OVER THE PHONE YEARS AGO, AS HE WAITED FOR HIS COMPASSIONATE RELEASE APPLICATION TO BE REVIEWED.

FRANK:  IN MY COMPENSATION PAPER, I DIDN’T SAY I EARNED THE RIGHT TO COME HOME, WHICH I DON’T THINK YOU EVER DO IF YOU TAKE SOMEBODY’S LIFE, BUT I ASKED FOR MERCY. THAT’S ALL I ASKED FOR, AND I CAN’T ASK FOR NO MORE.

[MUSIC]

JULIETA: FRANK SAID HE WOULD NEVER EARN THE RIGHT TO COME HOME, HE TOOK SOMEONE’S LIFE. ALL HE WAS ASKING FOR WAS MERCY.

MARIA: WHEN WE COME BACK, WE LEARN MORE ABOUT WHAT IT MEANS TO RECEIVE COMPASSIONATE RELEASE AND WE HEAR ABOUT FRANK’S CHALLENGES OF TRYING TO START OVER EVEN THOUGH HE IS TERMINALLY ILL.

STAY WITH US, NO TE VAYAS.

[BREAK 1]

MARIA: HEY, WE’RE BACK. BEFORE THE BREAK, WE LEARNED ABOUT FRANK ROSS’S LIFE, HOW HE ENDED UP IN PRISON, AND THE CHALLENGES OF HIS RELEASE UNDER PENNSYLVANIA’S COMPASSIONATE RELEASE LAW.

SENIOR PRODUCER JULIETA MARTINELLI IS GOING TO CONTINUE WITH THE STORY FROM HERE.

JULIETA: THE DAY AFTER FRANK’S RELEASE, I MEET SUAVE OUTSIDE FRANK’S DOOR ON THE FOURTH FLOOR OF A SENIOR LIVING COMMUNITY IN PHILLY.

[AMBI – WALKING INTO ROOM]

JULIETA: WE MAKE OUR WAY INTO THE ROOM. FRANK LOOKS FRAIL – MUCH OLDER THAN I’D IMAGINED. HE’S WEARING AN UNFASTENED HOSPITAL GOWN THAT’S FALLEN DOWN TO HIS STOMACH. HE’S HOOKED TO AN OXYGEN TANK AND FAST ASLEEP. SUAVE WAKES HIM GENTLY – HOLDING OUT THE BALLOONS.

SUAVE:  I KNOW IT’S NOT, I KNOW IT’S NOT TILL NEXT WEEK, BUT YOU KNOW, I GOT, I HAVE TO TAKE CARE OF YOU, POP. I HAVE TO TAKE CARE OF YOU.

JULIETA: SUAVE LAYS OUT A PINT OF CHOCOLATE ICE CREAM, A SLICE OF CHOCOLATE CAKE, COOKIES, AND OTHER GOODIES –

JULIETA: THAT LOOKS SO GOOD.

SUAVE: SO, SO, SO WHAT I’M GONNA DO, WE’RE GONNA SING HAPPY BIRTHDAY TO YOU. TO YOU. TO YOU. HAPPY BIRTHDAY TO YOU. YOU. HAPPY BIRTHDAY, DEAR FRANK. TO FREEDOM, HAPPY BIRTHDAY TO YOU.

JULIETA: HAPPY BIRTHDAY.

JULIETA: FRANK SMILES THROUGH THE CELEBRATION. BUT IT SOON BECOMES CLEAR HE’S NOT DOING WELL… IT’S AT THAT MOMENT THAT I NOTICE HOW SWOLLEN FRANK’S LEGS ARE. IT LOOKS PAINFUL – AND AS THE SHEETS SLIDE, I SEE A PALM SIZED ANKLE MONITOR SNAPPED TIGHTLY AROUND HIS ANKLE. A MANDATORY CONDITION FOR HIS RELEASE. YOU KNOW, IN CASE HE RUNS AWAY…THIS MAN, WHO CAN’T WALK ON HIS OWN OR GET OUT OF BED.

[AMBI]

JULIETA: IT’S NOT LONG BEFORE VISITORS START ROLLING IN.

VISITOR:  OH, MY GOODNESS. YEAH, THANK GOD. FRANK ROSS.

JULIETA: FRANK’S FACE LIGHTS UP. HIS SISTER-IN-LAW WALKS IN. THEN, HIS FRIEND MUHAMMED. THEY SPENT DECADES TOGETHER IN PRISON. MOHAMMED IS 84, OUT FOR A A YEAR NOW AFTER SECURING HIS OWN RELEASE UNDER COMMUTATION FROM THE GOVERNOR.

VISITOR: YEAH. THANK GOD, MASK-

FRANK: YOU’RE HERE, BABY … YEAH. THANK YOU. THANK YOU FOR COMING.

MOHAMMED: HEY, MAN. IT’S MY PLEASURE. YEAH, YOUR FACE LOOKS GOOD. YEAH, BEEN A LONG TIME. YOUR FACE– HEY, YOU LOOK GOOD.  SUAVE CALLED. I SAID, “WHAT?” I SAID, “I’M HERE.” HEY, YOU GOT A LOT OF NEAT PEOPLE COMING TO SEE YOU TODAY.

JULIETA: HE’S RIGHT – WITHIN A FEW MINUTES FRANK’S BED IS SURROUNDED. I COUNT FOUR FORMER LIFERS IN THE ROOM. MEN WHO ALL WERE ONCE SENTENCED TO LIFE IN PRISON AND THOUGHT THAT THEY WOULD GROW OLD AND DIE INSIDE TOGETHER…HERE. FREE – EATING CHOCOLATE CAKE. SHARING WAR STORIES…REMINISCING. SILLY THINGS, LIKE WHO STILL OWES WHO MONEY FOR COMMISSARY ICE CREAM.

SUAVE:  HE OWES MONEY FROM THE ICE CREAM, REMEMBER? MOHAMMED OWES, LIKE, 10 TICKETS. I DON’T KNOW WHAT HE TALKING ABOUT. THEY LEFT THE ICE CREAM IN BEHIND. HE, HE NEVER KNOW WHAT YOU TALKING ABOUT.

JULIETA: AT SOME POINT, SUAVE WALKS OFF AND STANDS BY THE DOOR – I SEE HIM DISCRETELY WIPE HIS EYES WITH HIS SLEEVE.

SUAVE:  HUH

JULIETA: HOW DO YOU FEEL?

SUAVE: EMOTIONAL.TO BE ABLE TO SEE HIM SMILE. LOOK AT HIM SMILING. LOOK AT HIM. AND NOT HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT COUNT TIME. I JUST THINK THAT FOR US, THIS IS WHAT IT’S ALL ABOUT. CHANGING POLICIES AND BRINGING PEOPLE HOME.

[MUSIC]

JULIETA: I STEP OUT OF THE ROOM TO GIVE THE FAMILY PRIVACY AS FRANK MEETS NIECES AND NEPHEWS AND OTHER FAMILY FOR THE FIRST TIME.

[MUSIC]

JULIETA: ON THE WAY OUT, SUAVE TELLS ME HE FEELS OVERWHELMED. HE SAYS HE IS WORRIED ABOUT HOW FRAIL FRANK LOOKS…

SUAVE: THIS COMPASSION RELEASE STUFF, TO ME, IS BULLSHIT. REALLY BULLSHIT. BECAUSE CAN’T REMEMBER WHERE HE’S AT, SITTING IN A BED WITH AN ANKLE MONITOR THIS BIG.YOU CALL THAT COMPASSIONATE?  FIRST OF ALL, I WANNA SAY I AM EXTREMELY HAPPY THAT SOMEBODY DECIDED, ENOUGH IS ENOUGH, RIGHT? BUT NOW I’M ALSO EXTREMELY MAD THAT THIS MAN SHOULD’VE BEEN RELEASED 10 YEARS AGO WHEN HE FIRST GOT CANCER.

[BUMP]

JULIETA: THE THING IS, … LEGALLY, FRANK COULDN’T BE CONSIDERED FOR COMPASSIONATE RELEASE ANY EARLIER.  EVEN THOUGH HE’S HAD A CANCER DIAGNOSIS FOR YEARS. FRANK IS REPRESENTATIVE OF AN ISSUE MANY OTHERS ARE ALSO FACING.

THERE ARE CURRENTLY MORE THAN 10,000 PEOPLE CONSIDERED SENIOR CITIZENS IN PENNSYLVANIA PRISONS TODAY. WHILE THERE AREN’T PUBLIC NUMBERS ON HOW MANY OF THOSE ARE ILL AND HAVE ALSO SUBMITTED PETITIONS FOR COMPASSIONATE RELEASE – WE DO KNOW THAT ONLY 54 PEOPLE HAVE BEEN GRANTED COMPASSIONATE RELEASE OVER THE LAST 15 YEARS.

MARIA: ADVOCATES SAY THE PROBLEM IS IN HOW THE COMPASSIONATE RELEASE STATUTE IS WRITTEN. WHILE IT’S MEANT TO REMEDY THE CRISIS OF THOSE AGING BEHIND BARS, IT FALLS SHORT OF ACTUALLY BEING ABLE TO ASSIST MANY PEOPLE – BECAUSE OF THE BUILT-IN REQUIREMENT FOR THEIR DEATH TO BE IMMINENT. AND, IN THE MIDST OF THEIR ILLNESS, THEY ALSO HAVE TO BE ABLE TO FIND A LAWYER TO TAKE ON THEIR CASE. THE REALITY IS THAT, BY THE TIME SOMEONE LIKE FRANK REACHES THIS AGE, THEIR CLOSEST FAMILY MEMBERS HAVE OFTEN DIED OR THOSE CONNECTIONS TO THE OUTSIDE WORLD HAVE FADED OVER THE DECADES.

JULIETA: NOT TO MENTION THAT IF, LIKE FRANK, THEY’RE LUCKY ENOUGH TO BE GRANTED RELEASE, THEY MUST REMAIN UNDER CONSTANT MONITORING. THAT MEANS WEARING A HEAVY, AND SOMETIMES PAINFUL GPS TRACKER ON THEIR BODY 24/7.

MARIA: AND REMEMBER – THEY CAN’T SEEK OUT HEALTHCARE TO GET BETTER. IF THEY WERE TO BE CURED OF THEIR ILLNESS, THEY COULD BE SENT BACK TO PRISON. SO PEOPLE LIKE SUAVE, LAWYERS AND ACTIVISTS IN PENNSYLVANIA HAVE LONG ASKED, “WHERE’S THE COMPASSION IN THAT?”

[MUSIC]

MARIA: WE’LL BE RIGHT BACK.

[MINI BREAK]

MARIA: HEY WE’RE BACK.

JULIETA: WHERE ARE WE GOING NOW?

MARIA:  SO, WE’RE IN PHILLY NOW, LIKE, I’M LOOKING AT, I THINK, 30TH STREET STATION.WE’RE IN A CAR ON OUR WAY TO GERMANTOWN, WHICH IS A LITTLE BIT IN THE SUBURBS.

JULIETA: A FEW WEEKS LATER, WE’RE IN PHILLY AGAIN – THIS TIME WITH MARIA. SHE’S KNOWN SUAVE SINCE ‘93, AND WHILE HE WAS IN PRISON SHE OFTEN HEARD SUAVE TALK ABOUT FRANK ON THE PHONE.

MARIA: AND YEAH, THE TEAM IS REUNITED. SUAVE JULIETA AND ME ON OUR WAY TO MEET FRANK ROSS. IT’S … I’M, I’M JUST, I’M SO OVERWHELMED BECAUSE IT’S, REAL LIFE.

JULIETA: SUAVE HAS BEEN SPENDING NEARLY ALL HIS TIME OUTSIDE OF WORK WITH FRANK.

SUAVE: I JUST STAY THERE ALL NIGHT, HANG OUT, BECAUSE IT’S 24 HOURS A DAY VISITS. SO I MIGHT JUST GO IN AT SIX O’CLOCK AT NIGHT, LEAVE AT FOUR IN THE MORNING, COME BACK AT 8:00, AND HE PROBABLY WON’T EVEN KNOW I’M GONE BECAUSE BY THE TIME HE WAKE UP, HE SEE ME.  I ALWAYS TELL PEOPLE WHAT I’M DOING FOR FRANK ROSS IS WHAT I COULDN’T DO FOR MY MOTHER WHEN SHE WAS ON THAT BED, WHICH IS TAKE CARE OF HER.

JULIETA: SUAVE’S MOTHER DIED BEFORE HE WAS RELEASED FROM PRISON.

SUAVE: THIS IS WHAT I WISH SOMEONE WAS DOING FOR ME IF I WAS ON MY DEATH BED. THIS IS WHAT I SHOULD HAVE BEEN DOING, YOU KNOW? SO I’M JUST DOING IT FOR FRANK,

JULIETA: WHEN WE ARRIVE, FRANK IS WEARING A SWEATER, SWEATPANTS AND TENNIS SHOES. HE IS SEATED UP ON HIS CHAIR, HAIR COMBED, WAITING FOR HIS VISITORS.

JULIETA:  HOW ARE YOU?  YOU LOOK GOOD. I DIDN’T EVEN RECOGNIZE YOU WHEN YOU WALKED IN.

JULIETA: SUAVE WALKS OVER TO FRANK AND HANDS HIM A FOLDER. IT’S FILLED WITH TYPE WRITTEN PAGES – SHORT STORIES THAT FRANK MAILED TO SUAVE WHILE HE WAS IN PRISON.

SUAVE: I’M GOING TO SHOW YOU SOMETHING. I GOT IT.

JULIETA: THEY TALK QUIETLY AS THEY LOOK THROUGH THE PAGES.

MARIA: THEY HAVE THIS LITTLE SECRET COMMUNICATION THING GOING ON, WHICH I JUST LOVE.

FRANK: IT’S THE NEW THING. WE GOT EVERYTHING THERE.

JULIETA: FOLLOWING AN AFTERNOON EATING HOAGIES – FRANK’S REQUEST – LAUGHING AND SHARING STORIES, FRANK TURNS TO ME –

FRANK:  FEEL LIKE OLD MAN. LIKE OLD MAN. DID I TELL YOU THAT I, I HAVE, UH, ON MY… WHAT’S THAT WORD? DEMENTIA.

JULIETA: YOU HAVE DEMENTIA.

FRANK: DID I TELL YOU THAT?

JULIETA: YEAH THIS MORNING…

JULIETA: HE ASKS ME AGAIN IF HE’S ALREADY TOLD ME HE HAS DEMENTIA.

FRANK: AND THAT IS SO CUCKOO AND CRAZY, MAN.

JULIETA: FRANK SAYS DEMENTIA FEELS “CUCKOO CRAZY.” HE SAYS HE FIRST REALIZED HE HAD IT A FEW YEARS AGO WHEN HE HAD TO BE HOSPITALIZED AND TAKEN OUTSIDE THE PRISON.

FRANK: LIKE ALL KIND OF CUCKOO STUFF IS RUNNING IN YOUR HEAD.

JULIETA: SO, WHAT DOES DEMENTIA FEEL LIKE? ALL KIND OF CUCKOO STUFF RUNNING IN YOUR HEAD.

FRANK: AND I REMEMBER WATCHING TV, AND MY MOTHER, AND SHE WAS IN THE HOUSE. AND SHE WAS DIRTY, AND HER HAIR WAS MATTED. SHE WAS ABOUT YOUR COMPLEXION. AND SHE’S BLACK. SHE LOOKED HORRIBLE.

JULIETA: HE DESCRIBES A MOMENT IN THE HOSPITAL WHEN SUDDENLY HE WAS TRANSPORTED BACK TO THE HOUSE WHERE HE WAS BORN IN 1933. HIS MOTHER WAS THERE, BUT SHE WAS DIRTY AND HER HAIR WAS MATTED. “SHE LOOKED HORRIBLE,” HE SAYS. HE STARTED CRYING.

FRANK: I COULDN’T BELIEVE THAT’S MY MOTHER. AND THEN I WENT BACK TO SLEEP.

JULIETA: FRANK SAYS THAT’S WHEN HE STARTED ASKING QUESTIONS – AND HE REALIZED HE WAS SEEING AND HEARING THINGS THAT WEREN’T THERE. THINGS THAT HAD ALREADY HAPPENED. OR THINGS THAT HE SIMPLY IMAGINED. BUT IT ALL FELT SO REAL.

FRANK: I WAS THE ONLY ONE KNEW I HAD IT. OTHER TWO DIDN’T EVEN KNOW THEY HAD IT. YOU TALK TO THEM ABOUT SOMETHING, THEY WALK IN, COME BACK, THEY DONE FORGOT IT.

JULIETA: HE SAYS IT WAS IN THAT HOSPITAL HE REALIZED HE WAS SURROUNDED BY OTHER DEMENTIA PATIENTS. HE WOULD TALK TO THEM ABOUT SOMETHING, AND THEN THEY’D FORGET AND HAVE THE SAME CONVERSATION ALL OVER AGAIN. HE REALIZED THEN HE WAS THE ONLY ONE THAT KNEW HE HAD IT.

FRANK: I KNEW I HAD IT, BUT I DIDN’T KNOW HOW TO CONTROL IT, ‘CAUSE IT CONTROLS YOU.

JULIETA: BUT HE COULDN’T CONTROL IT. IT WAS TERRIFYING.

FRANK: I DON’T KNOW WHY BROTHER DIDN’T TELL YOU. I DON’T KNOW WHY HE DIDN’T TELL YOU I HAD IT.

SUAVE: IT’S ALL RIGHT. I KNOW.

JULIETA: SUDDENLY, FRANK GETS REALLY AGITATED. HE’S MAD AT SUAVE FOR NOT TELLING US HE HAS DEMENTIA JUST LIKE THE MEN HE MET IN THE HOSPITAL…SUDDENLY, HE FORGOT.

DEMENTIA IS A PROGRESSIVE, IRREVERSIBLE SYNDROME. IT LEADS TO MEMORY LOSS, COGNITIVE DECLINE, AND REDUCED FUNCTIONAL ABILITY. THE DISEASE, COUPLED WITH HIS CANCER – IS STARTING TO RAVAGE HIS MIND AND BODY.

I STOP RECORDING.

ON THE WAY OUT, I CAN SEE THE HURT IN SUAVE’S EYES. AND IT’S THEN THAT I REALIZE HOW LIMITED OUR TIME WITH FRANK REALLY IS. FRANK HAS MADE IT CLEAR TO ME OVER AND OVER THAT HE WANTS HIS STORY TOLD… BUT I FEAR WE’RE FIGHTING AGAINST TIME.

AND  SOON — FRANK IS GOING TO HAVE TO TAKE ON ANOTHER FIGHT, AGAINST THE PRISON SYSTEM WHO WILL ATTEMPT TO TAKE HIM BACK.

[MUSIC]

JULIETA: OVER THREE EPISODES, WE’LL EXPLORE PENNSYLVANIA’S COMPASSIONATE RELEASE PROGRAM AS IT STANDS, AS WE CONTINUE FOLLOWING FRANK’S LIFE ON THE OUTSIDE…

SUAVE:  HE DIDN’T RECOGNIZE ME. HE DIDN’T RECOGNIZE ME AT ALL. HE’S LIKE, “GET THE FUCK OUT OF MY ROOM. I DON’T KNOW WHO’S YOU. YOU AN IMPOSTER.”

JULIETA: THE PRIVATE HEALTHCARE SYSTEM WITHIN THE STATE’S PRISONS THAT MANY INCARCERATED PEOPLE SAY FAILS TO PROVIDE ADEQUATE CARE.

MECHIE: … A HALF AN HOUR LATER, HE CAME BACK AND HE SAID, “MS. SCOTT?” “I’M SORRY TO TELL YOU, YOU HAVE BREAST CANCER.”

JULIETA: WE’LL HEAR FROM PEOPLE ATTEMPTING TO CHANGE THESE LAWS SO THAT INCARCERATED MEN AND WOMEN CAN BE RELEASED TO RECEIVE THE NECESSARY CARE THAT THE LAW DEMANDS…BEFORE IT’S TOO LATE. AND THE WAYS IN WHICH A SYSTEM THAT HE IS TOO SICK TO REMEMBER, STILL HOLDS FRANK’S FATE IN ITS HANDS…

SUAVE: THE DOC ALREADY PUT A PETITION TO REVOKE HIS COMPASSIONATE RELEASE. [GASP] THEY TOOK IT TO THE COURTS AND NOW WE GOTTA GO TO COURT TUESDAY.

[CREDITS]

MARIA: THIS EPISODE WAS PRODUCED BY JULIETA MARTINELLI AND EDITED BY MARLON BISHOP.

IT WAS MIXED BY STEPHANIE LEBOW. SCORING AND SOUND DESIGN BY JACOB ROSATI. FACT CHECKING FOR THIS EPISODE BY ROXANA AGUIRRE.

FERNANDA ECHAVARRI IS OUR MANAGING EDITOR. NANCY TRUJILLO IS OUR PRODUCTION MANAGER.

THE LATINO USA TEAM ALSO INCLUDES REYNALDO LEAÑOS JR., LUIS LUNA, GLORIMAR MARQUEZ, JJ QUERUBIN, ADREANNA RODRIGUEZ, AND NICOLE ROTHWELL

PENILEY RAMIREZ AND I ARE EXECUTIVE PRODUCERS

I’M YOUR HOST MARIA HINOJOSA.

“LATINO USA IS PART OF I-HEART’S MY CULTURA PODCAST NETWORK. EXECUTIVE PRODUCERS AT IHEART ARE LEO [LEE-O] GOMEZ AND ARLENE [ARE-LEEN] SANTANA.

JOIN US AGAIN ON OUR NEXT EPISODE AND IN THE MEANTIME, YOU CAN FIND US ON SOCIAL MEDIA.

AND DON’T FORGET TO JOIN FUTURO+ TO LISTEN AD-FREE AND GET BONUS EPISODES AND SPECIAL VIRTUAL EVENTS. BY JOINING, YOU’LL SUPPORT THE KIND OF REPORTING THAT MAKES EPISODES LIKE THIS ONE POSSIBLE! SO THANK YOU!

CIAO!

If you are interested in this topic, check out the podcast series Dying on the Inside: Women Lifers at Muncy Prison. At Pennsylvania’s State Correctional Institution Muncy, roughly 150 women serving life sentences, many incarcerated during the height of mass incarceration in the 1980s and 1990s, are now aging behind bars. Across the country, incarcerated women are experiencing accelerated aging, with chronic illnesses often appearing by age 35 and infirmary visits skyrocketing. Prisons like SCI Muncy are ill-equipped to meet the complex needs of aging women, as poor nutrition, limited exercise, and inadequate healthcare have contributed to a growing but largely overlooked public health crisis.

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